Minister of State, Foreign Affairs II, Senator Musiliu Obanikoro, tells BAYO AKINLOYEthat the Peoples Democratic Party will ensure that Saturday’s governorship election in Lagos State is not rigged in favour of the All Progressives CongressSome people consider you to be the ‘eyes’ and ‘ears’ of President Goodluck Jonathan in Lagos State. What is your relationship with the President?
I would say I am close enough (to Mr. President) to be one of his ‘boys’ -let’s put it that way.
What made you to be one of his ‘boys’?
I am one of his ministers. I am a loyal party man.
But people think there is more to your being close to President Jonathan than being one of his ministers. Why does he have much confidence in you?
You will have to ask Mr. President that question. This is why I said so: President Jonathan may even love me for some reasons that I don’t even know. The point, therefore, is that Mr. President is in a better position to tell you why he puts much confidence in me.
How do you feel about the President’s loss at the presidential poll?
It is painful. But as a Muslim, I have to take the loss in stride — God gives, God takes. The fact that President Jonathan came from nowhere to be the president of the Federal Republic of Nigeria, almost effortlessly, was an act of God. (In the same way) that (Maj. Gen. Muhammadu) Buhari won the just concluded presidential election is also an act of God. Therefore, I take it that it is only God that counts.
The Peoples Democratic Party has always said that it would rule Nigeria for 60 years. But after 16 years, the party has lost grip on power at the centre. What happened?
Let me make this clear: man proposes, God disposes. The point is encapsulated in the statement I made earlier that it is only God that counts.
But, didn’t anything go wrong to the extent that the President lost in the poll?
A lot went wrong. Nevertheless, in the face of all those wrongs if God had wanted the President to be re-elected, he would have been returned as the President. Something will always go wrong in human endeavours, anyway; it is human. Many things went wrong and there is no doubt about that because the presidential poll was an election we were supposed to win.
What exactly will you say went wrong?
For me, I think it is too early to be deliberating on that. I do not want people to characterise us (PDP) as bad losers. The truth of the matter is that the President has congratulated Buhari. Let us leave that (the issue of what wrong) for now. At the appropriate time we would talk about some of the things that went wrong. Do not also forget that we have an election coming up. In view of that, we cannot be dwelling on what went wrong — when we have another challenge ahead of us. (Dwelling on such wrongs) may further demoralise the people. On the contrary, we want to dwell on things that will energise our people and re-structure their frame of mind for now.
Looking at irregularities during the March 28 poll, we can talk about them all day — it is not just about the irregularities in Lagos. We can talk about the underage voting in the North. The connivance of the All Progressives Congress with the Independent National Electoral Commission in Lagos is also something that is mind-boggling and painful. Particularly in Lagos, most of the results that the INEC ought to have declared for PDP were declared for APC. And do you know that in some local government areas in Lagos State INEC did not bring election result sheets. They went somewhere else to doctor the results or fill it to suit the APC, who is their paymaster. These are some of the issues we are going to face on Saturday. And we are going to deal with these squarely. It is either INEC stands up and becomes an impartial arbiter which they are supposed to be or we will also challenge them squarely. But that to me (not standing up to be an impartial arbiter) is not an honourable path for them.
The honourable path is for INEC to sit or stand on the side of the people. Using their official position to hijack the mandate of the people and giving it to the people who have lost the election is very sad and unacceptable.
Focusing on the Lagos governorship election, what is your relationship with Jimi Agbaje considering the fact that some see Agbaje as being Chief Bode George and Senator Adeseye Ogunlewe’s ‘boy’ and you being on the opposing side?
Jimi Agbaje is his own person. He is nobody’s man. He is a very independent man. He is a man with a strong history of political activism. Do not forget that Agbaje was a member of the Afenifere group in which he played an active role. Apparently, he is not someone anyone can say, ‘Jimi is my boy’ or ‘Jimi is in my pocket.’ (Whoever thinks that way) I think that person will only be deluding himself -the person will only be living in fantasy because Agbaje will end up being his own man. And, that is what we need in Lagos today; that is why we are calling for change in Lagos today. We need a man who can stand on his own, who will not be anybody’s lackey.
Therefore, talking about my relationship with Agbaje it can’t be better. Let me add, what people do not know is that when we were having that serious political contest (PDP governorship primary in Lagos), Agbaje and I were still very close and our children are best of friends. This is probably the first time I have talked about this. It is in the imagination of the people to think that I will not want Jimi Agbaje to win the governorship election (slated for April 11). It is in my interest for Agbaje to win as it is in the interest of Lagos. There is no better time in the history of Lagos where the choice is very clear between two candidates. One that is very progressive in every sense of it with a clear record of public advocacy, of good governance and strong support for democracy, as opposed to someone coming from a civil service background, who we know very well, is going to be managed by someone whose tenure in Lagos is better forgotten than remembered.
Ahead of the governorship election in Lagos, how will you describe the chances of PDP since the thinking of some people is that you would have stood a better chance than Agbaje?
Let me tell you something; I have my strengths and Jimi Agbaje also has a lot of things that I can speak positively about. Thus, I think it is not fair to begin to bring me into the picture with just a few days to the election. My support for him is also complementary; because if you say, ‘Obanikoro has this, and Agbaje doesn’t have this.’ Or, if you say, ‘Agbaje has this, Obanikoro doesn’t have this,’ now that we are working together, we will complement each other for the good of Lagos. That is the way God has created this world: some will have certain things others will not. Others will have certain things some will not -but when the two now come together it will serve as complementary possibilities of what each person brings to the table.
Are you saying you are 100 per cent behind Agbaje?
If there is something more than 100 per cent, I am behind Agbaje. I am totally with him. I am not just with him for political reasons. I am with him because if you put the two (Ambode and Agbaje) together, Agbaje is a better candidate. And that explains — I was listening to Ambode’s jingle on radio where he was talking about the dream — our dreams — and I would have loved for him to be courageous enough to have a debate with Jimi Agbaje to show Lagosians what those dreams are all about and how those dreams will be achieved. The two debates they had Agbaje stood out in terms of presentation of his vision for Lagos and how to achieve it. Ambode could not even defend some of the facts that he has been talking about. Hence, the difference between Agbaje and Ambode is like the difference between day and night.
If you look at the background of Jimi Agbaje, he has always been on the side of the progressives all his life whereas you cannot say the same thing about Ambode. And there are many things that Ambode needs to talk about: How was the N20bn Lagos collected from the Federal Government expended? Who got what? I know he will not have a convincing explanation on that. I believe that Lagosians are very wise and inasmuch as they can talk about change at the centre and they are afraid of change in Lagos, it goes to show that the APC cannot be trusted.
Going by the pattern of voting in the presidential and National Assembly polls, APC is expected to win in the April 11 election. To prevent this from happening, what does PDP intend to do differently?
Whoever says APC is likely to win in the coming governorship election did not know about what transpired during the presidential poll. The election was rigged in favour of APC. We intend to be more vigilant and we are going to put our cards on the table for INEC. They must bring result sheets to the polling units. Results must be announced immediately they are available. What they did the last time was to ‘arrest’ results, went somewhere and tinker with them before announcing them. Even where we won it was the number of votes that gave us the victory that made it possible. They also tinkered with those votes to arrive at a conclusion that is favourable to the APC. For instance, in Ajeromi — Ifelodun, we won and the election was completed and concluded early enough, making it possible for the commission to announce the result on the day of the election but INEC refused to do that. Why? Because they wanted to tinker with the result. They also attempted to do same in Surulere, Governor Babatunde Fashola’s local government where we won hands down.
These are things that we will not allow in the coming governorship election. We have to be more vigilant and we are not going to tolerate all those things that transpired in Mushin and Shomolu during the last election where the APC colluded with INEC to deprive us of our hard-earned victories — and even in Epe, Ibeju-Lekki and Badagry they did the same thing. All over the state they were manipulating results. And we are also going to implore the people of Lagos State not to go anywhere immediately after the election. They should stay at their polling units and watch the results counted. People should be vigilant on Saturday. These people are desperate to win the election. They are going around harassing market people, traders, artisans, Igbos and other non-Yoruba-speaking people who are supporting the PDP threatening them and we are saying we are growing our democracy. Election is not just about casting votes; and these are the processes that these people are trying to interfere with. Once you hijack that, you arrest the processes and whatever you are putting on that is rubbish. And that is precisely what they are doing. Recently, it was reported that these people went to Ladipo Market to threaten the market people there that if they don’t vote for them they will wipe them off. Should a democrat act that way?
What role should security operatives play in the April 11 election?
I believe that they must be neutral as much as possible. That is the only way the election can be free and fair. And after the election we will have a peaceful atmosphere.
What is your plan for 2019?
For me, as regards politics and elective positions I think I am winding down. My son is already contesting for a political post. I think what my role should be now is to encourage him and support him to any level he wants to participate. It should not be my place now to be usurping or trying to lead the future of my own kids. I will defer to them and stay under this Yoruba proverb, ‘Erin ku o fowo boju; ogede ku o fomo e ropo.’ As we move to the backstage it is necessary to ensure that we put forward a befitting successor or successors who will take over the baton from us. Therefore, we are gradually winding down and we are encouraging the younger elements to take over while we guide them and give them the necessary support.
Does that mean you are no more interested in being the governor of Lagos?
I am saying that I am more or less thinking of being in the background than being the one to be contesting elections.
What if the people say it’s Obanikoro they want at that time?
When we get to the bridge we will cross it. After all, Buhari is 73 years old and he is now the president of Nigeria. And, mind you, it’s to promote my kids rather than promote myself. But if God says otherwise who am I?
Going down memory lane, why did you leave the Alliance for Democracy (which has now gone through several metamorphoses to become APC) for the PDP?
I left because of the leadership. That inconsistency itself has vindicated me. That the party has moved from Alliance for Democracy to Action Congress to Action Congress of Nigeria and now All Progressives Congress. That inconsistency is a vindication. What people are now seeing about the leaders of the APC in Lagos is what I saw; that the interest of the people is being put in jeopardy; that the interest of the people is secondary to their personal interest and that can better be explained when you look at the more than N200bn that a firm collected as consultancy in 16 years from Lagos State. That is to show that the leader of the APC in Lagos is more interested in personal interest than public interest. Just imagine what that amount of money could have done for the public good. More so, where our children are sitting on bare floors in schools, no toilets or water in our schools, even in our homes, where hospitals have been reduced to consulting rooms, where Lagos government is always in a running battle with medical doctors, where civil servants are not paid minimum wage, yet they can afford to pay before now N8bn per month, N6bn per month and now N1.5bn per month on an individual in a state where the governor woke up two or three years ago and increased school fees in Lagos State University without looking inward.
Even though the fees had been reviewed downward after two years, can the review compensate for the pain that he has caused in people’s lives? Can it compensate for those who dropped out of school based on that single act of increasing the tuition? Has he compensated them for that? No. Lives have been lost. And no amount of talk can save or change that. We have lost lives that ordinarily should have been very bright. Parents have been subjected to undue agony and pain — how is he going to compensate people for that? How? Careers have been destroyed with standard of education in LASU falling and I can tell you for the free that I do not know of anywhere outside Nigeria where anybody would accept LASU’s certificate. It is a very pathetic situation.
There is an erroneous perception of individuals who are supposed to be condemned but who are being celebrated in our society; people who do not mean well for public good; people whose antecedents have never been the welfare of the people but that of personal interest. How can one explain someone enacting into law a bill that gives someone the right to use government money after serving as a governor to buy a property of his choice in Lagos and another one in Abuja? How does one justify that? Is there anywhere in the world -in a civilised world -other than Lagos where that can be explained? This is ridiculous and criminal. Lagos people should stand up against that. The day PDP wins Lagos State, that’s the day Agbaje will go back to the House of Assembly and ensure that the law is struck down. Such a law is anti-people.
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